Swami Om Prakash Saraswati was the epitome of a disciple. Lovingly known as Swamiji, his commitment and surrender to his master, Osho, was total and absolute. Sent by his master to start a meditation center in Delhi, Swamiji as a true disciple, with love, devotion and dedication became the vehicle of his beloved master in spreading His vision. While he continued to work and promote the vision of Osho, he went deeper into his spiritual journey. While Swamiji blossomed in meditation, his inner growth manifested in his work. This section is dedicated to experiences of sannyasins who have come in direct contact with Swamiji at some point of time and have been inspired by his compassion, dedication and commitment.
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Q- Namaskar Swamiji
A- Namaskar Beloved
Q- Please introduce yourself by giving your legal name, Sannyas name and year and place of taking sannyas.
A- I am Prabhat Chand Tiwari and my sannyas name is Swami Yog Prabhat. I took sannyas from Bhagwan on 30th September 1976.
Q- In Poona?
A- Yes, in Poona
Q- What is your occupation?
A- Professionally, I am an Electrical Engineer but after migrating to America, I became a Computer Engineer. My Primary occupation is IT Counseling.
Q- IT Counseling? What is your date of birth?
A- My date of birth is 1st July, 1944.
Q- When did you came in touch with Bhagwan for the first time? When did you hear or read about Bhagwan? How was the first contact?
A- I came in touch with Bhagwan for the first time through a friend of mine who had come from Gorakhpur district to Lucknow seeking Bhagwan, I told him that there is a Professor in Lucknow University, Dr. Kushwaha Singh. It is in his place where the program is organized and managed by him. So, my friend went to Lucknow University that day to collect information about Bhagwan's program that day. The program was in Hazratgunj at a Madrasi friend's house.
Q-What was the program and was Bhagwan Himself giving lecture that day?
A-No, Audio discourse and meditation session was organized in the program at Hajratgunj that day. My friend asked me to accompany him to the program and in the evening at around 5 pm, we went to Hajratgunj riding on a cycle. When I heard Bhagwan's audio tape for the first time, I felt that He is the master I am seeking. I have searched everywhere, in south and in north but couldnot find anyone like him. So, listening to His first discourse, I felt that I was seeking Him only.
Q- So, you were saying that you came in touch with Bhagwan after hearing his discourse in Lucknow.
A-Yes, after listening to His discourse for the first time, I realized that I have found the master I was seeking. So, I spoke to Professor Sahib. He told me to do meditation for 2-3 months. And then I can go and meet Bhagwan. So, I started doing meditation in the garden of a ruined fortress where the English fought with the last ruler of Lucknow. That place is called Residency and is a beautiful place. Alone I used to go there with an audio cassette to do dynamic meditation. After three months, about ten people got ready to go to Poona to take sannyas. At that time my wife Smt. Mamta tiwari was at her maternal parents place. I informed her that I am going and if you want to come along then come over. So she also came along. About eleven of us reached Poona. Later on only I came to know that in the series running there at that time, Swamiji was also present. The series was on Mahageeta at that time in September. We stayed there for only two days and on 30th September, we came back. Swamiji was living there at that time and later on we read in the book Mahageeta the question asked by Swamiji to Osho. It so happened that when I started getting deeper into my inner journey, a camp was conducted at Kanpur, near Lucknow, I met Swami Om Prakash Saraswati for the first time. I was very much inspired by meeting Swamiji and thought that we will organize a camp in Lucknow. So I contacted Ma Laxmi in Poona. Ma Laxmi advised me to call Swamiji from Delhi. We were very happy and a three day camp was organized in Lucknow. Swamiji came for the camp with Masterji and brought along with him all the books available with him. We could manage to book a dharamshala for three days in Lucknow for the camp. The camp was very good. After the camp, often we used to speak to each other on the phone. In 1979, I again got the opportunity to travel abroad and Swamiji told me to come and stay in Rajyoga. On our way to America, We stayed in Rajyoga for a month. The experience and awareness that happened to me in that one month was something that had never happened to me before. I can still say that the experience that happened to me was very unique and one of its kind which I experienced in the company of Swamiji. That whole one month, we spent doing dynamic meditation, spending the rest of the day eating and drinking with full awareness and with full awareness doing whatsoever little work that needed to be done in Rajyoga. While taking walk in the garden I used to observe the plants, trees and leaves with such awareness that I never had before. Even while sleeping, I used to be aware. And that is why often I used to come here. Once when I was coming here, Swamiji called Vivek Bhaiya and asked him to come too. We both came here and for the first time we did dynamic meditation together. In the eighties, Swamiji himself went to America and to Rajneeshdham.
A- Rajneeshpuram. To meet Osho and participate in World Celebration in 1985. Swamiji took me along with him. All of us who could go there, I think, was due to Swamiji. We were not able to go to Rajneeshpuram even while living in America. Swamiji organized everything. We went to Rajneeshpuram and for fifteen days we were listening to our guru and experienced such ecstatic moments which is very unique. While returning, I asked Atul Bhaiya to buy the video tapes of the programs for me and Atul Bhaiya sent me the videos. We also copied the audio tapes available there and and sent them to a friend living in Lucknow. So it was again an ecstatic experience in the company of Swamiji there. After that Swamiji visited us in America and we were very inspired by the progress Swamiji was making and I also wished to contribute to the growth of the work of Bhagwan. Till now I donot feel that I have contributed much to the growth of Bhagwan's work but whatsoever was possible within my capabilities, I tried to be a part of the work with Swamiji. Whenever I meditate, either in the morning or evening, I called upon Swamiji, Ma Yoga Laxmi and Osho as my witness. It was a deep connection that I was sharing with Swamiji. Though we were living far away from each other yet I never felt distanced from him, on the contrary, it was a deep conncetion that I do not have words to describe. But I will not say that we shared a bond of friendship, or of being the disciples of the same master but a deep unique experience and connection.
Q- You had a deep connection with Swamiji? Can you tell something about the connection Swamiji shared with Osho?
A- The connection that Swamiji shared with Osho made him oceanic. He got enlightened and this was our first meeting after his enlightenment. I was planning to come for a long time but only this year I was fortunate to come here. It so happened that I had to go somewhere to attend a camp. Because of that camp, I felt that I had disturbed Swamiji. Swamiji asked me what you want to read and what you want to do will happen, just sit here silently and be here. I said you are speaking the truth but I need some time. Swamiji said "come and manage Oshodham, you do not have to go anywhere and do anything". I said I am not enlightened and managing Oshodham is a big responsibility . Swamiji said that just come over and be here. Then after sometime, Swamiji said "allright, I am giving you some time, take sometime, maybe one-two years but come over." I said that is possible but now give me some time. The day came for me to come and be here and I came. But the next day after my coming, Swamiji left his body. I thought I have been so poor that even I could not even give my yes to Swamiji. I felt very sad as so many things remained unsaid to Swamiji even just a word of yes but whatsoever happened has happened. Now I wish to fully dedicate myself to his work. I feel like kissing the feet of all friends of Swamiji for all the work they are doing so beautifully.
Q- You said that Swamiji was enlightened. What has been the force behind Swamiji's enlightenment?
A- Meditation was the prime force behind his reaching this level.
Q-How was Swamiji related to Osho?
A- The relation that Swamiji shared with Osho was very unique. We can tell only after attaining that level. We cannot call it a relation through the words we use to define a relation. It was something that we cannot define.
A- Master-disciple and the oneness of a master and his disciple. The unique merging of the two which one can describe only after attaining enlightenment.
Q- Anything you remember, any incident or nostalgic moments with Swamiji. In Lucknow or in Delhi? You had organized acamp in Lucknow and even in USA you met. How was his feeling towards your family. Did you ever feel that he is an enlightened man or an extraordinary sannyasin or simply an ordinary man like others.
A- In his ordinariness was his extraordinariness.
Q- How was his relation with your family?
A- He shared a very loving relation with my family. And we personally wished to bring him back to USA, if possible. We wished to bring him but could not do it.
Q- Why did you not think of coming back here?
A- I will come but I want to take all the people from here too who are here and had been doing His work. I wish to take everybody. I wish to make a model, in the lines of the Dhyan mandir that was built in America and present it to the friends doing Osho's work here, before I leave my body.
Q- With such love and dedication, it will certainly happen. Love, dedication and feeling always work in the world of Osho. Then it automatically starts happening. I feel that it is His inspiration that does the work.Going back to the first time when you listened to Osho. You said that you felt that you found the master you were seeking. Did you ever come in contact with others? What was it that you were seeking? What difference it made after you listened to Osho, how was it different from others. Please comment.
A- I had heard in my younger days that for an inner journey, one needs a master. My family had masters to follow, my mother and father had but I did not see anything unique in their teachings to guide me through my inner journey. From my childhood I felt that I need a master. When I was in the Engineering College, I kept seeking in the whole of South India. We went to Sai Baba's Ashram and tried to talk to him but I did not feel that he can be my mater or I could accept him. Then I found Maharishiji. I had listened to Maharishiji at Lucknow and he spoke very well. I liked him very much. When I told my wife Mamtaji that lets take diksha from him, she said that not even a week has passed after our marriage and you started talking about sannyas and diksha. So this is how I lost Maharishiji . So when I listened to the discourse of Osho on the tape, I instantly felt that he is the one I am seeking. This time I told Mamtaji that if you are ready come with me or I am going alone. She also came along and on 30th September, 1976, we took our sannyas. Not only me andmy wife but all the 1-12 people who went to Poona, took sannyas. So in Lucknow also we have a very good group of Osho friends and lovers. This time I have converted the small house that I have in Lucknow into a center and dedicated it to all of you and all Osho lovers. I wish to devote the remaining 4-5 years of my life to the work of Osho.
Q- After listening to the tape of Osho, you went to Poona. How did you feel when you saw Bhagwan for the first time? Any nostalgic moments?
A- I had a deep longing to see Bhagwan. I had read and listened to his discourses but when I went there for the first time, I had this feeling how Bhagwan will be. On the first day I asked mamtaji to go and I stayed back. The next day I went there. Osho was speaking and I kept looking at Him, I donot remember what He was saying. I kept looking at Him for about 45 minutes or so. Then I realized that my eyes can no longer keep looking at Him, it started closing and paining. Then I closed my eyes. My first meeting with Bhagwan was like this and when I had reached there I instantly felt that this is love.
Q- Did you feel that love was showering there?
A- For me, love was a puzzle. It so happened that I started loving a girl in my younger days and that love was not successful. That's why I did not get married in the following ten years. I said why get married? When I reached Poona, I instantly felt that this is love in fullness. And for the first time I felt that Poona is a heaven on earth. Even while leaving for America, I had planned to come back and settle in Poona and live there. But that did not materialize. You know all that Osho went to America and came back. Now I wish to dedicate the remaining days of my life to His work in both the places.
Q- Can you tell us something more on love like your falling in love with a girl and then in the presence of Osho.
A- When I was in studying in college, this girl came to my place one day, met my family members and went away but after she left her voice kept ringing in my mind. For the next seven days her voice kept ringing in my mind. Wherever I was and whatever I was doing, I was lost in her. I kept remembering her only all the time. I thought now what to do and then decided that I have to do something otherwise I will go mad. So I went to her hostel. She was a medical student. I went to her room and found her mother there. I told her mother that I want to speak to her daughter. She called the girl and I told her that I want to marry you. She said that she will ask her father. I left saying that I want a reply once she had asked her father. So again I went to the hostel to get her reply but found out that she was in an operation theatre. As told, I went to the operation theatre and saw a strange expression on her face. So I went straight to her father and asked him what has he decided. In fact, they are distantly related to us. He told me that you are kids to think about such things and devote your time to studies. We will talk about this at a later period. I told my father and he got very angry with me and got me out of the train in which we were traveling. He said that you had humiliated us and why did you do this and that you should not have done that. I had to get down in a place where Kabir Das lived. From there I went to our village and then returned to Lucknow and from Lucknow to my college. I had returned to my college before the holidays were over. So I did not get married for the next 8-10 years. Then people started saying that you have lost your mind and if you do like this how will the girls of family will get married. So I said allright, when is my marriage and got married to Mamtaji.
Q- So after seeing Bhagwan, you realized the meaning of love.
A-Very true. There only I came to know what love is. For what I was desperately craving, it was showering there.
Q- Anything else you want to say.
A- I have already spoke a lot about myself whereas I wanted to speak about Swamiji.
Q- Do you want to say something about your experience in meditation.
A- I feel that meditation is the only route to attaining the ultimate truth. And I wish to spread the seeds of meditation wherever possible through dhyan mandirs or call it dhyan research institutes so that we make make meditation simpler for the intellects to understand.
Q- You came in touch with many communities, religions and masters. You had once told us about Chinese and Tibetan techniques of meditation. What difference you find between Osho meditation techniques and others?
A- As we have read that when Osho was seven years old, on the death of his maternal grandfather, Osho had conducted Poa, a technique used by Tibetans to send the soul of the departed to such a place from where he an again start his journey in the company of a Buddha or an enlightened master. Osho recited those hymns at that time. I had the urge learn Poa. There is a lady belonging to the Vajrayana sect who has a very big ashram. I went to her ashram and learnt all the techniques the people of Tibet follow from the people there. This lady is a bodhisattva and she has taken the vow that she will have to make all the beings enlightened and for that she will take as many births as required. I had never seen a more knowledgeable person like her. I used to think that only Madame Curie was the most knowledgeable lady but when I met this lady I felt that there is no second like her on this earth. Her dedication and compassion is no less than Buddha. There are about a hundred monks in her Ashram. Everyone of them is dedicated to the same cause and they have this center in Tibet, one in Arizona and a third one in Australia. The book that you have with you has the picture of that lady. Even after being there and learnig their techniques, I would still say that these people are more into active meditations. They say that though we are meditating there is no deepness in these meditations as one experiences through Osho's meditation techniques. We became a close unit and I wanted to introduce Osho's dynamic and Kundalini meditation but could not do so. There was a Chinese Zen group of about 30 people. I introduced to this group Kundalini and Nadbrahma and had a very good experience. Once it so happened that while doing dynamic meditation, one girl fell down during the stop stage and she had cut her lips and started to bleed. I asked them to take her to the hospital but their master said that donot worry, we will take care of her. But later on they had to take her to the hospital. I was not in their favour, had she been taken at that moment to the hospital, she would have got well. But their master was a great healer. This master came to my center seeking Osho and wanted to see the photographs of Osho and listen to His audios. There he told me to leave all this and join him in making a center. When Osho began His ashram, 400 disciples lived with him and whatsoever was earned had come from His discourses in audio, video and books. So felt that I could not leave now. But the Chinese master established a center and in my opinion it has grown into the biggest center for the Chinese people. Many people are in that center. All Osho books that had been translated into Chinese had been read by him. He invited me to conduct dynamic and kundilini meditations. He stopped conducting dynamic meditation but other meditations are still conducted there.
Q- You mean to say that other religious groups and organizations run by enlightened and knowledgeable masters are still trapped in worldly affairs?
A- I very much agree with you.
Q- You mean, Osho's vision and His techniques are simple and direct?
Q- There are many healers in the world with whom you came in contact. And there are some of them who along with their disciples are seeking Osho like you said that one healer is seeking Osho.
A- Yes, most of them had read about Osho's techniques and are using them. They speak the same in Chinese and says that its their original work. But this healer named Mao, came from midland, China and he is an honest man and whenever he picks something from Osho, he tells that he had read Osho. We never had any contact before and our first meeting was when he came with 6-7 people. When they saw the first video of Osho, they all started crying. They all belonged to Taiwan.
Q- We were talking about Swamiji as a disciple. We came in close contact with another disciple and that is Ma Yoga Laxmi.
A- Because of Ma Yoga Laxmi only that I came in touch with Swamiji. It was she only who said from Poona that call Swamiji. When Ma Yoga Laxmi went to America, I drove with you to New York in seven hours. It was my first meeting with Ma Yoga Laxmi and we reached there at ten o clock at night. After having dinner, we kept talking to her till four o clock in the morning. Nobody felt tired or sleepy in the company of Ma Yoga Laxmi. We three-you, me and Ma were there. Then Ma said that we have to leave now and we drove her back to New York. Ma was a strange epitome of strenth. Even during those days of hardships we found her laughing and making other laugh. She was a strange lady among all His disciples.
Q- Any similarity between Swamiji and Ma Yoga Laxmi. You were very much inspired by Ma Laxmi and in love in totality. With Swamiji also you lived in total love. Any similarities?
A- I feel that both of them were connected through meditation and Bhagwan. They were connected totally and shared a bond of deep love.
Q- Osho's energy?
A- Yes, both of them were blessed with Osho's showerings.
Q - You had a long association with Ma Yoga Laxmi. After seven hours of journey, you sat in the company of Ma till four in the morning and again drove her back. Where did that energy came from?
A- That night was a full moon night. I kept driving but never felt tired. Then I gave the wheel to you. With Ma Yoga laxmi, it so happened that she came and stayed with us. One day she said that her stomach was paining. Mamtaji took her to the hospital. To the emergency ward and it was found that she had cancer. It was such a situation at that time that there was no scope for her to avail medical facilities. But there was such a facility that if you go to the emergency ward, they do not refuse to treat. She was operated upon and the operatio was successful. Every evening 20-30 sannyasins used to pay visit to her with bouquets in the hospital. Ma got well very soon and despite having cancer she chose to live in totality. I also remember one incident when she was arrested in New York, the authorities asked her to speak against Bhagwan and promised that they will release her and give her a green card.
Q- Or against Sheela?
A- Yes, but Ma said, again you are trying to crucify Christ. It is impossible for us to speak against Him. Later some friends bailed her out with three-four thousand dollars. She was arrested in New York before arresting Bhagwan. Bhagwan had mentioned that these people have arrested one of my disciples.
Q- Now Ma is not in the body and Swamiji has also left his body. You were very much inspired by both of them. With their inspiration and Osho's blessings, what is your plan for the future?
A- With much difficulty I could come out of US this time. I said to Osho that if you donot take me out of here then there is no way for me to return. But got the chance to come here for 3-4 months. I never thought I could come. I used to think that at least I should leave for India to start a center I should establish one US and leave for India. That too has been done. Then I thought that my son is not associated with Osho. So after reaching here, I requested Swamiji to give sannyas to my son when he comes here. Swamiji said leave him to himself. What is the point in giving sannyas to others. But that kept lingering in my mind. When I reached my ancestral village, one of my nephews approached me to give him sannyas. I was astonished. I thought I wanted my son to take sannyas but my nephew came forward to become a sannyasin. I took him with me to Nepal and Ma Jyoti gave him sannyas. I donot believe in planning and achieving but I feel that whatsoever the feeling is should be done. I feel that through my thoughts and feelings He is doing everything.
Q- He is doing through us.
A-I am ready with my body, heart and soul. I wish to establish a center there because the existing center is very small.
Q- You want to establish a center in Washington?
A-Its all His wish.
Q- It will be His wish but you are putting your best efforts.
A- Yes, I am putting my best efforts with my heart and soul.
Q- With your feelings and Osho's blessings, it will happen. Thank you Swamiji.
A- Thank you very much for listening to my narration.